Wayne Infrastructure Committee Reviews Road Projects, Budget Priorities

[0:00] Brian: Brian and Mark and David and I are here as a committee members and Shannon is here as the road commissioner town manager so we're all here we're all together and we're ready to go to work so my apologies for having to have you look at four copies of the minutes but maybe if I'm good next time I won't we won't have to worry to do that so much so the first thing we need to do is that we're we're here we have a quorum and it's i got 9 35. okay so the second thing to do is to [0:40] David: we need to approve four sets of minutes i make a motion we approve the minutes of april may [0:46] Mark: june and july as written okay second okay i would say that we better look at we better look at june [0:57] Brian: know first before we do that because it's june with changes yes tj i'm good okay so on the financial update in june i've got an extra zero there so it's really one 1.7 million it's not 1.7 with four zeros but that's the only change that i know all it's about six lines down it [1:34] David: wasn't june it was it was mad it was in may yeah may 11th [1:40] Mark: not june okay may 11th other [1:46] Brian: than that i think i've been through them a couple times i think they're all set okay so we have a dave made a motion do we have a second did we have a second it second brian okay in favor okay pass five good thank you very much okay so the next one is working with shannon as a road commissioner plan manager and any updates that you need to know all going on i can review some of the expenses [2:28] Shannon: So far i've got to talk with our tax collector treasurer. She's been out on vacation this past week as far as the bottom line budget. We haven't paid out any of the invoices yet in addition to that. So i'll start with the full entry, completed the pre-limiting, and roughly the law on those six notes. You were aware of that in the last meeting. That was a amount of 22,686 dollars and 88 cents. that did get paid out we have since contracted with tech industries for a ditching and culver park and so that first contract was for 528 121 dollars and five cents okay so that's on the six roads we're going to put the one inch on that's for the six roads plus the fairbanks and hard [3:14] Speaker E (unidentified): scrabble okay so all eight that's all eight roads yep that was the initial contract ditching [3:20] Shannon: and the continuing culverts plus the additional work so the 153 plus the 290. it's the no this is the 290 232 for the base bid item work right plus the 237 889.5 cents [3:39] Mark: so they add alternative those two okay which was just people yeah that's just beginning and [3:45] Shannon: Other things have changed, so the ditching in culvert's change order was for two hundred and thirty one thousand one hundred and eighty dollars. So that includes, if you want to break down, was the ditching and culverts was for one hundred and fifty three thousand six hundred and eighty dollars. That was on a contract for a bed. And then the additional work that we had met with them for was the pavement for the driveway Abrams. That was $13,500. The additional 250 cubic yards of crushed stone for the reclaim was $15,000. And then we have four 18-inch cross culverts on Fairbanks and Hard Scrabble Road. And then the installation for 200 lineal feet of 18-inch culvert pipe came out to $49,000. So that added additional was $77,500. So again, the total for the ditching of culverts plus the additional was $231,180. [4:54] David: So what did that do our 704 bottom line? So if I have one more [5:01] Shannon: And so we've had another one more amendment, and this is because they are telling us that it's going to come in less. And so we have an additional amendment to factor in the rock removal on Hardscrabble Road for three thousand two hundred and forty dollars, ditching on Fairbanks Road for one thousand two hundred twelve dollars, and then the driveway culvert removal up on Bessie Road for seven hundred twenty dollars. So that added five thousand one hundred and seventy two. That brings our bottom line to seven hundred and sixty four thousand [5:39] Speaker E (unidentified): 473. Yes, but they feel that some of you don't feel the difference. Yeah, that may come in less. [5:47] Shannon: Okay, when they actually let us, because of some of the degrees of ditching and marks up wise a lot of that and work with us too. So I appreciate that and the update and Brian, thank you. I feel [5:59] Speaker E (unidentified): fill under a 799. Yes, yep, so [6:05] Shannon: that's where we're at with all of that, so [6:09] Mark: You did amend the contract instead of using a ditching amount, right? Yeah, just so that way they have that in there. [6:15] Shannon: And then we'll come back with less. Our attorney recommended that we do any amendments to the contract in the same format that we did the original, so that way all of the same change the information here is perfect. For road closures, they've been kind of keeping me in the loop on road closures with some kind of, it's supposed to give us 48 hours notice. Sometimes it'll be for a Monday and they let me know it's Thursday evening. So it's been a little short notice. I've been trying to keep up on posting it online and sending out an email. It's been a little challenging in some cases because sometimes I'll just put the sign there, but they are now expecting, I think our timeline has shifted. They've completed all of the ditching and I believe all the culverts. They should be starting on paving for all eight roads. It got pushed from October 1st to October 6th. [7:14] Speaker E (unidentified): Well, they're gonna start next week, October 6th. Yeah, I don't know the order of the roads. [7:19] Shannon: Yet, when I get that I will do some advertising, some publishing. I haven't pushed back from the citizens on the poachers at all, or not really. I've had some people, just, I had maybe one call, I don't know if it was a Monmouth resident because they wanted the other end in Monmouth, Hardscrabble, to be closed. But I had that one call and then just some calls about Fairbanks in the most recent closure because that was a last minute closure. Yeah, that one was pretty last minute and they said oh we'll just be there on the day, so letting me know on a Friday or Thursday or Monday, it was kind of short, so on a weekend. But as those come up in the future, when they do Fairbanks and Parts Gravel, if they close that one again, then I will post all that [8:08] Speaker E (unidentified): through, but it should be pretty quick. So I think it was mostly the recall. Usually when they pay [8:13] Brian: they don't, the rollers are on the top of the hill at Hardscrabble right now. Okay, yes, well so [8:20] Shannon: they wanted to start on Monday, today, if the roads were wet, they said, I think so, that way it would [8:26] Speaker E (unidentified): keep it compacted, but yes, so I'll check on that. One comment that I would make, and when we do the [8:34] Brian: make these again, I think that we ought to close the road at the end of where it intersects with somebody else, because like in Hardscrabble, you drove a mile and a quarter and you came to the road flow sign when you came off the north Marmos end, so down at the north smallest end, even if it's at the town line in Wayne, I think we ought to put a road flow, this road is closed, you know, so that people won't try to drive off through, particularly because we're going to be doing the same thing on the Berry Road. When we start tearing the Berry Road apart, they're going to be coming across, was it Kings Highway? So I think at the end of Kings Highway, there ought to be a sign that says Berry Road is closed so that people don't come in and try to go that way. That's just a comment for when you do them. Okay, great, thank you to steal one of their signs for a couple [9:37] Mark: Up on Ranch Chapel, they had another one that's almost falling. We're going to leave them kind of behind bushes too now. This was in a while they were out and working on these stones. [9:49] Speaker F (unidentified): I think Corey told me so as far as part of this gym, so they're going to come in under. And Mark, would be good if we could just start now checking their quantities of what they've said they've done. So they're supposed to have given us daily logs. I got to remind, I drove all the roads yesterday because you just got back. But to see what I missed, but I didn't miss much. Yeah. And all they did was grind out the terminals of the terminus is all roads where I can match it. So they're ready. Yeah. So they're ready to lay. So if we can get those, we can just start measuring how many feet of ditching they actually did. So make sure that what they're saying they've done less is actually there. [10:35] David: It was good they put the jute to it too. That's kind of- Every one of them. [10:39] Speaker F (unidentified): Yeah, that was- We had a spec only said only on three vines greater than 6%. And they did them all. They did them all. [10:47] Mark: That's what I think they did. Even better. Yeah. Beautiful job, I just don't see anything. [10:52] Brian: So we still have, were these numbers then are we still about 400 000 available for next spring? [11:00] Speaker E (unidentified): I'll get that, I'll confirm that with our record, okay, but that's what we had when we were talking. [11:07] Brian: In July there would be 400 000 left, okay, so just so we've got an idea of what we think we can do later on is all. Yeah, okay, great, thank you man. And so it's the two we'll need to finish. [11:25] David: Hardscrabble in fairness, yeah, and then it doesn't have to be done in the spring. Well, okay, what I. [11:32] Brian: Want you, yeah, we're jumping a little ahead, but what I'm thinking about is to get the solve it in very and then do very and yeah Richmond the next spring, but that's jumping. [11:48] Mark: Ahead of race, okay, so anything else man? Yeah, so. [11:55] Shannon: Let's go over current, we haven't extended too much of this year's operational budget. It however I do have winter sand on our next upcoming accounts payable. I have ordered our winter salt. We have done one round of patching, and that was on Barry Road, King's Highway, Mount Pisgah Road, and North Wayne Road, and I did make note that some of those were not entirely. So I'll follow up on that. We'll do another round of top hole patching. For grading, as we get into that, I think under new business or old business, we'll talk about grading performance specifications. So we can get that put out there for you RFP. Painting. I'd like to sit there and get your input as far as speed control devices for old Winthrop Road. We had sent out an email previously for road painting or signs to slow down traffic on Old Winthrop Road at Brook Train 133. So I'd like to get your input as far as what would be beneficial there for painting. [13:09] Brian: Would you like it now or later? [13:12] Shannon: I'll take it whenever. [13:13] Brian: OK. There were four emails that went out that said don't put... Right. [13:17] Shannon: That's what I understand. OK. No speed bumps. Right. So painting. [13:21] Speaker E (unidentified): Painting. So what kind of people? Okay. All right. That's what I'm asking. [13:26] Mark: I would narrow away. I think yellow, although I, know that the professionals say the yellow lines and the white lines still drive it down. My brain doesn't work that way. So I don't like the yellow line. I think I'm on a bigger road and I've gone faster than this WL line, but that's not what the profession is. So they do like Chevron used to kind of look like that 's almost three-dimensional well the white just the white lines like narrow give you the vision of a narrower road yeah so that's supposed to slow traffic down and they say the [14:02] David: same thing with the double yellow and sounds like that's the least expensive way in so maybe try [14:07] Mark: and start with that right because there's no hand decal stuff and then yeah you could start with that chevron's you would mention chevrons like across well on the pavement not on it's not It's not necessarily a crosswalk, but it would look like a crosswalk, right? Yeah. Maybe that works too. Yeah. [14:24] Shannon: Is there a particular spot going down the hill on Old Winthrop Road that would [14:28] David: be- What is the complaint about? Is the complaint the library or is the complaint back at- [14:33] Shannon: Well, I got some good feedback on the crosswalk in front of the library this year. So that's good. We want to keep that. But I think as we approach that area, because people are coming down the hill, I don't want to put it in front of Gott Road because I don't want to make that a confusing intersection, [14:46] Speaker E (unidentified): intersection, but maybe just beyond that we were trying. So just yeah, where was the exactly? Okay, so some chaperones right at the bottom of the hill. Okay, and maybe some signage. Okay, yeah, that's slow. Yeah. [15:02] Mark: Okay, slow. Library anyway, they're on 133. There's some signs of grant money paid for the flash. I don't know if I need flashing, but it says village area ahead of something. So I don't know where you could have something that says adjust the area. [15:18] Shannon: I don't know. Yeah, there are grants for that. We could do one through the main municipal association. They have a misproduction grant, a safety grant. I can see which one that applies to. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Slow speed. [15:31] Mark: You don't agree with that? Slow speed signs? Slow speed signs? Well, I don't think they do that in that way. Okay. But the ones that they put on 133 fly. But they are flashing. [15:42] David: Yes, but... And I know some people will like them if you get turned around. [15:45] Mark: Yeah. But I think that we're just... I don't know if it would say Benajarian or Library Head or Churchman, but SimSigns. Okay. Right? Anything besides speed files. [15:55] David: I guess start with start with one thing and then keep adding if it's not working. I mean pedestrian crossing the head a lot of the times you see people are complaining and they complain that [16:05] Mark: their speed bumps are causing problems so I get weighed that a lot and I've been waved that in that section of my dump truck. Okay, so like they stand out there and you do this carry-on thing slow down and I'm going five miles an hour below the speed. So whether or not that these people that complain actually have taken a class in school, of course not, right? Okay, but is there [16:27] David: really an issue is the question I'm getting. We all go too fast, there's no doubt about it. Yeah. [16:33] Mark: There's probably no, I'm literally looked down on five miles away but my truck bank. [16:40] Brian: So the sensitivity, the consensus of the committee then is to put chevrons, start with show starter chevrons, and then the next step would be to put some kind of non-non-lit silence. Well, I [16:53] Mark: think the white lines can narrow the road more. Okay, more than the shepherds. So that the least expensive I believe would be just the line painting machine. They would put white ropes [17:05] Brian: on white lines on the sides and the devil will be all done. Oh, okay, so you're talking about the, you're talking about the paint that they put on so the cars won't go off the road. You know, there's no one that, okay, because I was misunderstood what you were talking about and then I would go chevron so that doesn't, so you're just talking about a single white line on [17:26] Mark: on the shoulders. Yep, and look at a whole solid yellow line in the middle is what the state would [17:32] David: Recommend a slow traffic down. Okay, that's different than Shannon because now you probably need to run it up to Gock Road, if you're going to do that. I thought we were just going to get the chevrons by Steve Dodgings. [17:46] Speaker F (unidentified): Oh, no, I think you should start striping after Gock Road. [17:49] David: If you're going to do- Coming down the hill. If you're going to do a line, road line striping, [17:53] Speaker F (unidentified): start at Gock Road. Right that whole section. [17:55] David: And go to one of those- People will freak out. [17:57] Speaker F (unidentified): There's no other way to do it anywhere else in town. Not a bit. [18:00] David: They should do that one time on Ponder when they put them down. Okay. [18:04] Mark: Well, I think the chevrons are a great idea, but they have to put a template down I assume that costs more than just a striping machine. [18:12] Brian: So the consensus then is striping from the guard road to 133, white on the sides and double yellow in the middle? Yeah. [18:20] Speaker F (unidentified): Okay, great. Any signs that we can get? Yeah. Okay. Okay. All right. [18:26] Shannon: Since we're on the topic of signs too, I was going to ask if the infrastructure committee has any input on placement of signs, like street signs, stop signs, road signs, person The person I typically reach out to I think has been busy, so I'm not able to get those signs in place. I was looking to see if we've got any alternatives. [18:47] David: We'd need to drive around, look and see. There's some missing. [18:50] Shannon: I know where they are. I didn't know if you know of anybody who can actually place them. [18:53] David: Oh, you want them to be put them in the ground? [18:55] Shannon: Yeah, I can't do that. I mean, I could help, but physically to put them down into the ground. That's been my probably number one phone call from residents. Hmm. [19:09] Speaker E (unidentified): replace signs. Yeah. Really. Yeah. Missing signs. I've got, well, some older blue smiles. [19:14] David: I used to go out and get a shovel. [19:17] Speaker F (unidentified): Someday. If anyone had here had a machine, I could take it back to them. [19:22] Shannon: Right. I searched online for sign placement. They seem like sign developers that make personal or business signs. And I have, I'm taking a DOT class, but this last portion didn't apply to Rhodes. The next portion in October does. So I've reached out and asked and I haven't heard any response yet but I'll follow in that class but I didn't know if you just knew anyone or not yeah I heard it I'm not doing it right [19:47] Mark: Okay I mean that's what they do well the easiest people are people who have [19:57] David: laborers right that'd be good labor yeah which is what do you need I've got it and if you need a [20:01] Mark: crowbar I'll take it on you just take it on the ground shake it around what the folks yeah and [20:06] David: Stand up with a sledgehammer, pound the sign off of the back, would pick up. [20:09] Mark: Pretty simple. Okay, I'll need the signs in my heart while we're on that. Yeah, I witnessed [20:17] David: something very unusual on 133 that, you know, the D.O.T. has been over in the boat launch a lot, and I watched them remove the no parking sign. I thought it was you until I turned around and [20:29] Shannon: looked. D.O.T. removed no parking sign because it conflicted with one of our policies, our ordinances. [20:35] Speaker E (unidentified): No kidding. [20:36] David: Yeah. So they only moved one. [20:38] Shannon: There was, yeah, there was one, it was on the side closest to the boat ramp. They should have been moved separated out further because they were too close to the boat ramp. According to our policy, our ordinance online, they were further down. So that way it allowed people to park on that side of the road. [20:54] David: Okay. Verified. I just thought it was very odd. He's out there taking his sign down. No, that was okay. He left the pole though. That was coordinated. Post but it's on the, it's on the north side of 133 is the one that took off, not the bull ramp side. [21:06] Speaker E (unidentified): It was across from the book, right? Should be on the boat ramp side. It was across. Okay, I'll take [21:12] David: a look. Thank you. Know for some, yeah, I just thought it would be all right. We're talking about [21:18] Brian: signs. Why is there a sign on Old Winthrop Road? There's not a sign on Low Winter, but why is there a sign on Pisgah Road and a sign on Fairbanks Road to stop, and there's no sign on Old Winthrop because old ones are not supposed to stop. I know, but why should I, really don't understand why Pisgah stops. It's a T road. Yeah, Fairbanks comes into it. Do we, do we really need to sign on if [21:49] Shannon: Old Winthrop doesn't stop and they take a left, then it would be stopping the people on Pisgah. [21:55] Brian: Right there, yeah, but you got there's two stop signs in at that three piece intersection. I don't understand why the straight road from Pisgah to Old Winthrop isn't just go. I think [22:08] Speaker F (unidentified): if you're coming from Mount Pisgah, you're coming up and around the corner, so if you're pulling out of Fairbanks, you don't see that car, right? So you need to stop that Pisgah traffic to avoid the conflict with, okay, you know what I'm saying? Okay, there's something [22:26] David: that's probably terrible on the Fairbacks and he came straight through, you're gonna be a T-ball. [22:31] Brian: Don't be a team. Okay, that's, that's good then. Yeah, fine, thank you very much. Where it's coming [22:36] Speaker F (unidentified): all the way up Old Winter, if you see it, I think you can see it all the way. So next man, so no, we [22:41] Shannon: Did have a sinkhole right down here. Thanks for bringing that up, out on Walton Road and Lovejoy Pond Road. The sinkhole looks like it was a result of a failing culvert that goes across Lovejoy Pond Road. So Walton Road and Lovejoy Pond, that intersection right there, couldn't exactly find the exit for it or the entry for it. No, finally entry. Was it that? It kind of just went in? Yeah. Yeah. So for now, it's a temporary fix. We had a contractor go out and dig out the cut out the tar and fill it in with fill, but he said that will probably come back up at some point soon. So that needs to be considered moving forward in maintenance. That is going to be a big replacement cost for that full culvert. That's probably a huge one. [23:34] Speaker E (unidentified): Isn't it? 's very long. It seems like I'm dynamic otherwise, but it's long feet there. [23:41] Mark: Should be an, I think you mentioned it was probably a hundred feet. A hundred feet forward, didn't it? [23:47] Speaker E (unidentified): Well, it looked like it went all the way down to the dam. Wow. [23:51] Brian: You've got 18 inch culverts, though. [23:56] Speaker F (unidentified): You used it on crust culverts for hard gravel and Fairbanks. [24:02] Brian: Okay, all right. [24:05] Shannon: So keeping that in mind. And then also in your packets right in the back, we've got all of the boards and committees this policy this year, and so this is actually from 2025, and requirements for that is just to review it and sign it annually. So now that we're in fiscal year 27, just request it and review that and sign it. If you have any questions, please let me know and I'll bring it to the select board. [24:39] Brian: The one that we have in our packet has a sign placed on the back. It won't align this. [24:45] Shannon: Not okay. Yes, that one online was the actual ethics policies. I've never slept for. Yeah, this is the acknowledgement, and there was one I added for TJ. If you want to look on our website under the infrastructure committee meetings for today, it is on there, and I can also send it to you as well. [25:05] Speaker G (unidentified): Did you get that? I'm looking right now. [25:10] Brian: Okay, [25:13] Shannon: And other than that, I don't think I have anything else at this time. So, yeah, we did put down on here, expectations moving forward for the infrastructure community. So for the purpose of, my role as road commissioner. Commissioner had to be productive with the time that you have up here looking at what your expectations are for the road commissioner during these meetings, and likewise I'd also like to receive your input on some of these things, so like signs, all factors, painting for RFPs, and things, I would like to get those out to you more in a time like that. In return, turn like that, I'll get some updated information as my advisors on some of these [26:10] David: practices. Yes, my question to you is what can this committee do for me? I mean, what do you want, what [26:18] Speaker E (unidentified): do you want us to step up and do that we're not doing well? Specifications is one thing, and I know [26:23] Shannon: that you're going to address some of that later in the meeting. Otherwise, I do appreciate the input for potholes and where they're located, for signs, for other maintenance. I know in the past couple months Mark, did come up and say there's a sinkhole here, there's potholes here, so even just throughout the month before you meet, just keeping me abreast of everything that was going on, Brian coming up and just meeting with me and meeting and walking me around downtown showing me stuff that needs to be addressed on the dam, because that's also part of the infrastructure committee, and having that discussion, so that way when we come to the table, maybe getting a ZF update and stuff that we need to continue looking forward into our [27:09] Speaker E (unidentified): budget. Does that make sense? Yes, [27:14] Brian: because we've all, we've all committed that we would do road inspections if you want, if anyway you need it, so and I do appreciate your help [27:26] Shannon: to in hosting science when the time comes to point out those signs. As far as budget, I think that we've put a big focus on our budget here, whereas I'm more so just rather know what the work is that needs to get done, and then we can figure out how to fit that into the budget and when the appropriate time is to get those RFPs out, because I can't get the RFPs out with the technical specifications and specifically what you want added. We're going to talk about [27:54] Brian: that a little bit at the end of the meeting, so thank you. Well, [28:02] Speaker F (unidentified): so for me the inspection stuff is something that Mark and I just do because we're bored, but we just want to go, we just go out there like, oh my god, Mark was already here. The bad thing is he beats me early, I go late, he goes early. I got a lot of questions this year. [28:20] Mark: Like which I'm not opposed to. I talked to you in the beginning and I just, well, at the funny I could say that I didn't have anything, but I didn't. I added something the other day. I was like 100 feet so much more. I haven't taken from you in order to make everybody look a little bit smarter. We had to ditch an extra 100 feet so that we ended that cross over in us in this rich. Yeah, so that wasn't that you were, I think. [28:55] Speaker F (unidentified): Was Monday, labor was a Monday when you're out there. So all the homeowners always want to know like my mailbox or this, so they make a lot of those decisions so quickly. Yeah, so and Vierson, if you got complaints from Mr. Ryerson, we did have them re rebuild her mailbox so there was, they did put it but she thought it was too close to the ditch, so we had to put it in five six feet closer. [29:21] Speaker E (unidentified): Her to her driveway and little things for you because of the drop off afterwards with the hook. Yeah, so it's a little thing. So if you want to know these little, oh I do, who we help right. [29:42] Speaker F (unidentified): That's what matters the most ultimately right and who's, so we took care of. So when you go there you take care of citizen complaints on the spot, so it's easy. And Pike has been so good, they're just like oh yeah we'll fix that, we'll fix that, whatever they are, they don't hit us with a change order. [29:59] Mark: Thank you, that's very good. Well yeah, for a lot of those things yeah, and they were just a pleasure to workplace yeah, and their entire thing from truck drivers to foreman there was, I never received a single bit of attitude when you asked for something or it was just yep we'll take care of. [30:23] Speaker F (unidentified): That like on Hard Scrabble the greater guy was grading after they re after they reclaimed and I just asked him if he could put his blade out and shave down the shoulder so the water because we didn't do any ditching on that, so just to should somebody watch is there you're just going to get to him, just kind of get to him, so he was just like sure he just does it right. And then when you're halfway down the hard gravel where it starts to turn down the hill there's a big outcrop of ledge so the guy. Was laying out the road, the edges of the road in the center of the road and he said I think we should shift this whole road over a couple feet and I'm like. [31:00] Mark: I agree, shifted over two feet so we have the base over there yeah, so he made sure it was. [31:06] Speaker F (unidentified): What so it didn't fall into the ditch on the right outside yeah, so it was, but things like that they're. [31:11] Mark: just happy to do it well you just got to be there and i was there and i asked how deep they were going they were going three and a half i said that's not enough i'd like to go deeper what do you think you're going five or six doing five they did do you know where what they were getting into were they below the base now they didn't really get any more rocks after the i was there and they told the folks that are you by seven they don't they think we spent four or five rocks right [31:40] Speaker F (unidentified): And they ended up taking a dozen. I was there. You just, you have to take that little thing and that [31:45] Mark: seems like a very fair price, so it would be the three thousand two hundred dollars. [31:50] Brian: Was your prayer that me, that it sounds to me that it, that the corrections or the spot inspections and looking at that these two are doing and they're changing, are all right with you without [32:03] Speaker E (unidentified): coming back to you and saying should we? They do, they have come back to me with the exception [32:10] Shannon: of this personal death, and we'll talk. You just said there was some change on Monday. Oh, it was [32:17] Mark: in this area. Yeah, that's great. So Brian and I got together, we said on our thing to various ditching on 400 feet, 400 feet on, so to the north side, what did we say, north side on the, it would be the east, but it didn't say where it was, so they called and said where is this ditching. Okay, and so we went up together and said all right, this bitching must be here. Yeah. But that didn't make sense to stop 100 feet shy of the crossbow. Correct. Yeah. So we would have looked kind of silly to not get a ditch to where the ditch goes. [32:54] Speaker E (unidentified): Yeah. Yeah. I'm grateful that you both went up there. Thank you. [32:58] Mark: So, yeah, as I forgot to tell you. Thank you. [33:02] Speaker E (unidentified): All right. I got it. I think Todd has also been giving me updates too. [33:08] Mark: So yeah, very community, yeah, right, I think, yeah, a lot of questions, all the answers, just and then [33:15] Speaker F (unidentified): so my thing is let's do these eight roads and do them well, right, so people see good stuff, and then that means for me we need to finish the graveling on the sides of the road, right, so once we've finished this last corpse, we gotta, you gotta do the shoulder work, okay, so it doesn't start to undermine with the drainage, with the rain and runoff coming down the edge of the page. What do [33:37] David: they do on going up Old Winthrop Road? It's really, there was a spot really bad right above the got road where it goes, and then that in that yank, did they ever fill that in? I think they pulled [33:49] Mark: the shoulder up where they get stolen. It's really bad. Okay, good, we're gonna make sure [33:55] Speaker F (unidentified): They do before we do the following, yeah, so that's that one driveway that was in the spec that we said he, we met, I was going to shape it with the asphalt again. Look at that, I looked at it yesterday, it didn't look like they haven't done it much because they were going to do it with any placed asphalt. Let's try to get it, you know, it looked like Dodge's driveway, they cut it straight along the front edge where we wanted it cut, like eight, ten feet back. Yeah, so that's not laid out or cut, that's the only one I saw of all the eight roads, those two driveways. [34:30] Mark: So we'll just keep an eye on that one, I guess. Okay, yeah, Dodgers had a, an apron that's buried with sand, so we need to get, because it's a gravel driveway, but we weren't where they originally marked that, we didn't go up to the hot tub, so we would have had this little skin. It's a gravel driveway though, don't you? Yeah, but it has like an eight foot apron. Yeah, they only showed the [34:56] Speaker F (unidentified): ain't just about saying shit, I'm just married because he is kind of the low spot at the bottom. [35:01] Brian: I know that, I appreciate you guys going out and doing that, 's great. [35:11] Speaker F (unidentified): I would say it's the most important part, we can talk about it right, great, so you're not out right, all this great stuff, yeah, you don't go out and see, you gotta stand, you gotta stand right there. [35:19] Brian: What do you matter, right, so anything else, man? No, that's fine, okay, great, thank you. So we'll go on the old business in and then the tree naming specifications, we had talked about that and what I'm going to request is that the next time we meet is that we have the current RFP for the, for that, so that we can talk about it and say this is what, you know, how wide is it going to be, how tall is it going to be, and that kind of stuff, because I don't, I can't, I don't know what they are right now. I know you guys you've all worked on, but I don't, so and the tree living, we probably won't do much until next spring anyway, so that'll be a good winner, let's get this squared away. Okay, and the same thing with, oh there was a question on diameter of trunks, how big and how small is a tree, and I think when we do the brush and limbing we can work that out. [36:29] Shannon: Same thing for canopy height too, because we have two different bits, one we had specified I think 15 feet, right, and the other one took it all the way to the sky, saying that they presented more back from the buck, but honestly, do we want more canopy or do we want less? [36:48] Brian: 15 and we'll talk about that and 15 is good. Yeah, okay. The next one was to review the roadside moines specification performance specifications. We, there was a question about that about what we'll learn using. We never did come up with an RFP that said this is what we want done to my knowledge. [37:13] Shannon: That's roadside mowing? Yes. So for roadside mowing, I have, I think, two primary questions. One, how far does it go from the edge of the pavement in, or does it go from center out? How wide is that usually? [37:30] Speaker E (unidentified): Is it from the edge of the pavement? From the edge of the pavement. [37:33] Shannon: Okay. Is that 64 inches or something? [37:37] Brian: What we had talked about at the last time. Well, all we had talked about at the last meeting was to the bottom of the ditch. Correct. Okay. No matter what the width was. Right. It wasn't given. It just said mow to the bottom of the ditch. [37:56] Speaker E (unidentified): Okay. Mow to the bottom of the ditch. [37:59] Shannon: Right. What if there's no ditch? [38:02] Mark: You're just mowing the little tiny hole there. Okay. Yeah. That's the thing. If the ditch is right next two feet of shoulder and then the bottom of the ditch is another two feet, well, you can't ask them to mow 72 inches because they can't. Right. Yeah, well, they can. [38:19] Speaker E (unidentified): Still get that a different kind of. Okay, and then also what time of year does that [38:27] Shannon: usually occur? Do we do it once? Do we do it by separate different comments on that last contract? I think they did it once, typically the end of July, beginning of August. I've heard different things as far as doing it in June and in August or beginning of July, just before Fourth of July. Is there a time frame? Because none of that affects our fiscal year budget too. [38:50] Mark: Since approximately 2010 or 11, we've done it once a year. Okay, and that has always been in the end of July range. Okay, well, with a lot of barriers, a lot of variants when it gets like a no sooner [39:09] Shannon: than and no later than date, like no sooner than July 15th and no later than August 15th. [39:18] Speaker F (unidentified): That sounds reasonable. 15 to August 15. Does that sound right? Yeah, okay. One of the things I would [39:26] Brian: say when you do that though is whenever they cut, make sure that they clean what they've cut off the road so it's not laying there. And I'm thinking down at the bottom of Morrison Heights primarily two years ago when they cut the brush, you just let it drop right in the middle of the [39:42] Speaker E (unidentified): road, on the middle road side of the road. So is this brush removable or is it roadside? Because I just picture somebody with a lawnmower just riding the edge of the road, he cut it with all [39:52] Brian: It was roadside mowing because it was that's when it was done, but there was a little bit that bamboo [39:58] Shannon: type, yeah, that's right down there along Font Road, but as you come to work, yeah, that's where [40:05] Speaker F (unidentified): they end, that's where they start to ditch or holding for Brobert at the bottom, well anyway [40:11] Brian: But back where the back where the back where the brush removal. No, that was just that was just back where the it's back right where the pasture, right where the hay field is. There was a big growth two years ago. It's the same thing that we talked about with brush removal. Don't leave any junk. So just we're talking about mowing, Dave, and with specs of the RFP specs for that for now so [40:46] Shannon: Do they make you clean up things or not [40:48] Mark: Usually okay, but I don't know if you got the right story that because there's a private resident [40:55] Brian: that cleaned up a bunch of that stuff this year, but two years ago when they mowed it they didn't play, they just dropped it and left it right in there, and the way that they left it they dropped in on the other row, okay, they're collected on the sickle barn, something happened, so you know, so two years ago it was there, yeah, did it make a big difference, no, but it just did, you know, you're driving down and I don't think that it should be done, I think I should think it would [41:19] Mark: be July 15th and August 15th, I think it would be easy to put a one-liner in that to avoid leaving mowing debris in on paper, right, they own, and if he's gonna have to think with them and they get some spot like that he can kick it off, oh yeah, he doesn't have to pick it up, you just have to [41:41] Brian: get it off, exactly, yeah, okay, so I really didn't, are you taking notes, I know you are, but are you, do you, do you want us to do any more about roadside mowing or are you all set, I [41:58] Shannon: your draft, okay, and then you can kind of go through and that's where I'll give you a red pen and then if you just scratch it out and then I'll collect them from you, the paper [42:10] Brian: All right, so the next thing then was to review the road grading performance book specifications [42:20] Shannon: Road grading performance specifications, yes, I think that's what I handed out last, I can go get a copy of that if you want and just take a look at it. I don't have any questions about it right now, but. [42:34] Brian: Well, do we want to do it? Do you want to do? [42:37] Mark: Do we need to do it before you intend on putting that up? [42:41] Brian: I'd like to. Yes, then we need to look at it today then. Okay. Okay. So while she's doing that, we had talked the very road culvert to have that done before for the this winter and I don't think it's been anything's been done about that yet do we still [43:01] David: want to do that we're running out of time at this point we're listening we have money we have [43:06] Brian: four hundred thousand dollars you know but you know but well yes all right I know I did but no there's four hundred thousand dollars but that's got to get done before Berry Road and Mills Road to be done yeah so and there's some work on those roads that they need to go with that or you could go across well yeah but this is the big cross culvert that we have we've done a lot of talking about at the last meeting we had we said we [43:40] David: wanted to get it done this fall yeah what happened by October 15th I don't see you I don't even see that how far in November you want to really start tackling that well and I think we [43:55] Mark: get a better deal if we put stuff out early and not like it sorry right why are you going out [44:00] David: within a month you want it done at this point I think we should probably look at putting it out [44:05] Mark: first thing is for the sprint no but in the winter for spring put the bid out in like back to where yeah that it's ready to roll on May 1st or April 3rd right like [44:17] Brian: not wait till May 1st but if anyone needs to do this okay because we had said last time that we recommended October 15th so what we want to do is back that off and say recommend to do it in the spring put it out the bin put it out to bed in February and March put it out for spring construction and that's just the Berry Road deep cone you don't think we should well I know we should do them all but this if you know what the Richmond knows you think there's like [44:48] Mark: two on Richmond Mills okay well we should do a nice little package and say I'll do all of them [44:53] Brian: all three of them at the same time three two well two rows two rugs and three pink holes I would maybe we need to count them well then what we need what when I say we because it's really two guys are going to do it what you need to do is you need to go out and do a pre yeah a free an inspection for cross culverts in the next month or so that we can make that packet up in February and if you're if you're willing to do that would be great just like you did with the other ones yeah okay thank you thank you [45:46] Shannon: Yes, Let me know if there's anything on there that you see that we change or needs to be updated. Sorry, Tj. I'll have this for you. So Tj. [46:00] Brian: yes okay the first the first one is culvert should be located and marked to ensure no damage but it doesn't say who does that did we say who does who marks the culverts or did do we want to the contract to mark them we [46:28] Speaker E (unidentified): take it out yeah we should discuss that well [46:35] Brian: yeah you know what they say to do is to take that out it doesn't need that doesn't need to be in there and then that's the consensus of the of the road advisory of the infrastructure advisory committee okay this is all the [46:54] Speaker F (unidentified): graph all gravel workers right just saying one and so they're all listed on the second title [47:00] Brian: title yeah so efforts made to retrieve any material that's migrated to the soldiers [47:07] Mark: to the shoulders okay travel [47:12] Brian: grade travel lanes on the gravel roads graded to a cross slope of a minimum of a half a foot per lane width so a five a ten foot road will have a five inch ground crown. Potholes shall be undercut. Talk to Mollis about that. They don't undercut potholes. No gravel or sawdust in windrow to be left in between the road and the ditch slope. Cut the road edge to assure proper drainage. Reshape the road surface to make a proper crown. and that's in two places do we really need that second one it's not bad for emphasis [48:06] Mark: but the most important thing okay found the down road proper crime okay finish the [48:13] Brian: finish grade the entire road whatever that means does anybody know what that means [48:24] Speaker E (unidentified): not a portion of the road but the whole grade the whole region i think that could be gone [48:31] Shannon: goes without being said great [48:35] Brian: add additional gravel as required problems with that line and it tells what the spec should be from mdot so what's [48:46] Mark: okay the problem of the line the problem with the line is if mdot type a gravel is not seven to twelve percent fines passing through the 200 sleep so verse okay so you've changed the specs on the DOT gravel by adding that line also I believe type A gravel through DOT is inch and a half not three-quarter so [49:15] Shannon: what should we have down there for should we add in a portion for additional gravel added and we need a spec for it or just [49:24] Speaker G (unidentified): did you guys see that camp road spec that i had sent a while back yeah i wish i had it with me that had a good that had a good spec for the surface the gravel let me see if i could [49:39] David: Find that real quick in case we'd like to use the chip stone and other, you know what I mean, that's what we don't need to spec it. I mean it, you don't need it everywhere. Yeah you do. [49:52] Mark: Everywhere you're adding a lot though. Well this is, we're not adding a lot, we're adding [49:58] Brian: something surface gravel. We're not reconstructing in a grading process. So there's a discussion now TJ between adding regular bank run gravel that meets the spec for some order to add the crushed [50:12] Mark: gravel that wears a lot better. The, so if we're getting into a situation where we need to add the base and that's a whole different thing, right, this is talking about, that's the whole side [50:24] Speaker G (unidentified): I could, I've got the, I've got the gravel road maintenance manual from, well it's put out by Maine Department Environmental Protection in Kennebec County Soil and Water Conservation District and I thought, I thought the problem with the crushed gravel was that you know it tends to, it tends to rut or get the washboard effect that you guys don't like and that you needed something with a little bit more fines in it, right. [50:57] Mark: The seven to twelve percent is a good [50:59] Speaker G (unidentified): number. Yeah and that's what this, that's what this, that's what this Camp Road you know has in their gravel spec this document and I thought it was more in line with what we were discussing last time for the top course and this does have a nice specification in it for your base course, your structural course that you know would allow you know a coarser larger size top stone to build up the road and then allow a good drainage underneath it, you know the ability for water to seep through and then a specification for the wearing surface you know over the top might be worth just, might be worth just looking at that. I could, I could email it to you guys right now real quick if you want to. Yeah great, in contract though [51:54] Mark: we wouldn't be looking for a base travel in a graded contract. No you wouldn't, you wouldn't you [52:00] Speaker G (unidentified): wouldn't, but it's in there you know and then it talks about, it talks about the spec for the top course is what I'm trying, that's what I'm trying to say right, that's the one that's together. Yeah and this has a, this has a really nice, this is a, this is a really nice document, it talks about drainage on the side of the road, this is something, this is something that's worth [52:19] Brian: looking at. Okay so then the way, do we want to have him email that to Shannon and ever put it [52:28] Speaker G (unidentified): into the, I'll send it right, I'll send it right now, you guys can check it out, hang on one second. [52:34] Speaker E (unidentified): Okay, he sent it out previously. Yeah, it doesn't say. Is there a specific spec though [52:40] Speaker G (unidentified): that you want added in here? Oh, let me, I'm just looking for the page it's on right now, and then I can run it by you, see what you think. While he's looking for the page, we'll compact [52:53] Speaker E (unidentified): the road to the roller, and then take out the last one, the coordinator, the contractor, because I reach out to another contractor for that separately. Coordinate with the contractor plan, unless you think that should all be included under the contract, that coordination that doesn't [53:11] Mark: happen, so that can be crossed. And if we go back to compact the road rollers, we should specify some kind of roller, shouldn't we, the size and, yeah, like a weight. Yeah, I don't know what that weight it is, but it should be in, include a week. We don't want the little hot dog thing [53:33] Brian: Yeah, wait, and also whether it's a vibratory or a straight wheel. Is there a difference? Do we want to, do we want to recommend a vibratory roller instead of a straight wheel [53:45] Mark: wheel roller? Right, it should be a vibratory. I don't know, is it a 10 time over [53:50] David: or not? No, there you go. No, you should call us about that. 's everything on the wall. Yes [53:58] Speaker G (unidentified): So on page 22 of that document is the, is the gradation for the road surface materials. Okay, if you want to look at that. No [54:11] Mark: service in this piece of town. It's in your email. I just searched my email and you're gonna [54:17] Brian: have your damn power to get your email anyway. Okay, so everybody is looking forward on their [54:25] Speaker F (unidentified): their emails and can go back to the first one about cobras located and what the contractor [54:32] Mark: shall locate in marco cobras to ensure no damage. Yeah, that's better. I mean, you're probably, you're [54:38] Brian: just covering yourself, right? Yeah, that's good. That's good, right? Yeah, leave that in the sake of [54:45] Mark: The contractors shall mark all culverts to ensure no damage. [54:49] David: It also says no work, culvert search. [54:51] Speaker F (unidentified): So the first one? Yeah, it's the first one, yeah. [54:53] Shannon: Contractors shall mark all culverts? [54:56] Speaker F (unidentified): Yes, shall locate and mark all culverts to ensure no damage. Just kind of put the emphasis on that. [55:05] Brian: It's an additional step that they'll be taking, but it's a good thing to do. [55:10] Shannon: For the second one, the efforts that shall we need to retrieve any material, do they dispose of that as well, or don't push it in the [55:19] Speaker E (unidentified): ditch, keep it in the rowey, we'll see, so ever it shall be made to retrieve that is migrating. Okay, and that just means putting it back into the room. Yeah, bringing the stuff from the sides [55:31] Mark: just don't push it out. Okay, that too. All right, I think that's what that means. That's how I read it [55:53] Brian: Okay, so have you found the spec ship for the thought wearing surface? Well, I got his email. I can't find where it's talking about. Well, my question is, do we want to use bank run or do [56:07] Mark: we want to use crush? I believe it should be three quarters crushed broadly with the fines not [56:17] Brian: at the seven to twelve percent. Okay, but is that banked on crushed gravel or [56:25] Mark: it's bankrupt crushed? There's muscles, so it's just a crust. It's okay by a three-quarter. It's not the company that there's basically possibly three places in our area that you can get it from, McGee Pike, which is pricey, and then the place over in Pettox, RF Pettox, which is in the blue. [56:58] Speaker G (unidentified): There's a couple of things. Do you want it from a quarry that's drilled and blasted and crushed to three-quarter minus with fines? So they're drilling and blasting a rock face of some kind, or there's sand and gravel operations that dig bank run gravel and crush some of it, some of it gets screened out, it'll be round stone because it'll just naturally be at a three-quarter minus size, won't see a crusher, but you'll have some crushed and broken faces, or then there's people that just dig bank run gravel, there's no crusher, and they screen it to three-quarter inch minus to get out any of, you know, cobbles, and then sell it like that, you know, so those are your, those are your typical types of sources for this type of material, and your number one source that you [57:51] Mark: mentioned was the rock face. That's currently what we've been using for many years, and we'd like to make sure that I personally would like to keep using that gravel. [58:04] David: Wouldn't we just make it as a crushed, a crush like we said in the beginning, crushed three quarter inch with five, seven to ten, seven to twelve percent of fine? But now you can get into a crushed grab, a crush, it doesn't matter as much as much, but again, you've got to maintain it, you [58:25] Brian: can go through a crusher with it. Well, no, but if you use bank run, you're not doing bank run. But when you say crushed three quarter, you're not saying it's ledge, crushed three, quarter. Well, like the PEDEX. You could say, you could say it meets what he says, but then it kind of was saying, go ahead, TJ. [58:43] Speaker G (unidentified): You could say, you could say, you know, crushed screened three quarter inch minus road surface material from a hard rock quarry or a gravel bank, and you know, have it just read just like that. And so if you want crushed and broken faces on your on the coarser fraction of that of that aggregate, then you know you should put it right in there. And that could come a suitable material could come from a gravel bank, but it's going to be processed with a crusher, or you could go to a quarry and buy it. Three quarter inch minus per those specifications. So I would just say something along those lines right in the spec. If you if you're looking for crushed and broken faces, you could get that from a gravel bank as long as they're crushing, or you can get it from a quarry where they're definitely going to be crushing. [59:43] Brian: My problem with a gravel bank is though you're going to have round sand in there that it's going to that is going to washboard very quickly. Yeah, if you have a long strike, I prefer the crush crushed off a quarry head. Okay, then that's what you put in your spatula. [1:00:03] Speaker G (unidentified): Then that then that's that's how you write it, you know, you get you're going to buy it from a quarry. [1:00:07] David: Okay, does that limit our options? Yes, that leaves Zach out. I don't care about Zach, I'm. [1:00:15] Mark: I'm just saying, sure, we need our options for pricing. [1:00:18] David: If you narrow it down so tight, you're going to be, one guy's going to be doing it, and it's going to be very high priced. [1:00:24] Mark: We're going to end up with three, but Mike, McGee, and Peddler. [1:00:29] Brian: But the other benefit to using that, Dave, is that you don't have to go back every month and regrade it. Because Monmouth has to regrade their road every month because they use Bank Run. And it's even doing it as often as they do this and that's not true. So I really I would vote to say that we use for a run three quarter minus with seven to twelve percent fines is. [1:01:05] Speaker G (unidentified): That okay crushed I'm putting crushed yeah crushed okay that okay with you TJ I mean it's you know it's it's it's a lot of just local preference and what performs you know well that you have available locally. And so you know there's nuance to it 's that's perfectly fine if that's what you want right. And then you know you're looking around you and you see also what's in the area that actually performs the way you want right. And so they have to be you have to be a little careful with that I don't. mean to be wishy-washy, but if you want options, then you know you should consider that. Okay, I know a lot of materials that perform adequately once they're in place and in the field that don't meet specifications, you know what I mean? And so you just got to be wise to that aspect of it. And you know, for a town like Wayne where we can, we're having these types of discussions, I think we can have that flexibility if there's a source in the area that works. But if your guys' experiences that you need you know a crushed quarry product that will hold up and not washboard, then you know you should put that in your spec. Okay, good, thank [1:02:25] Brian: Thank you. Okay. Do you need anything else on grading, ma'am? [1:02:31] Shannon: I think that will help, and I will clean that up and clean up this, and we'll get that sent over to you all. [1:02:37] Brian: Okay. So the next one is the Berry Road culvert, and we talked about this a little bit. We had originally said to have it done by October fifteenth, but at this point that's not gonna happen. So what Brian and Mark have agreed to do is they're going to go and look at Berry Road and look at Mills Road, Richmond Mills Road, and come back with the same specifications like they did the last time for Hodge Scrabble and Fairbanks. that same and that'll be done like in between now and the middle of december so that you'll have some time to get that rfp out for that section okay don't look at me like that fine next Dexter pond road that's on the second page of the agenda well does this need what [1:03:46] Speaker E (unidentified): is a rope missing yeah which one yeah anything else you have to say about the reading that would be [1:03:53] Speaker F (unidentified): there was that one rose missing yeah this new one that looked on them [1:03:59] Mark: oh that's wash [1:04:08] Brian: okay all right so at the last meeting we had talked about the dexter pond road rock sandwich And to have that recommended an rfp sent out and have that done by the fall of 2,017. Is that still the seventh years of the 2,027? 17 is gone by. Hasn't he done like that? Is that still okay with the committee? it was a yes [1:04:41] Speaker F (unidentified): because of the work we want to do in 2027 yeah i mean you're looking at the berry [1:04:49] Shannon: road culvert we're going to have to consider this lovejoy pond culvert that one oh this one right here yeah we want to talk about doing the overlay for hearts travel and fairbanks and then there's also the dexter pond road requirement which will be a big construction i think as far as blasting Potentially right that road like isn't that ledge? [1:05:10] Speaker F (unidentified): Well, that's that is all that is well, that is all that's extra time. [1:05:15] Speaker E (unidentified): That's what I'm talking about. That's what I'm. [1:05:17] Speaker F (unidentified): That's not this. Oh, yeah, this is just the last spot. [1:05:23] Brian: The first when you come down off the asphalt. Asphalt, yeah, the first two up two, I think it's a thousand feet, we set to put up what's called a rock sandwich on there because that is right in the middle of that bog, okay, and in the spring [1:05:39] Speaker E (unidentified): time it's just impassable, so is that like building it up with rocks on each side and then putting [1:05:48] Mark: more fill? Yeah, we historically we have never done this rock sandwich idea. What we've done in the past on the gravel roads where there was bad spots is you grade out what's there, put down fabric, the type B gravel, the larger size, like eight inches to a foot or whatever, and then a good surface and apples on the surface on top of that, and that's fixed that problems. Rock sandwich, like you mentioned, is fabric, rock, more fabric, gravel, right? So we haven't done that. We just get the fabric in there underneath the regular gravel and it's worked pretty well. It's very everywhere the cost that got it, Stricker Ferry Road got it, Roger got it, okay. Well, if there's a [1:06:33] Brian: different way, fine, but you know, I'm just, and what Brian had come back with was instead of a rock sandwich, he'd come back with rock tolls in that. What he had done is he put rock and he put rock in the bottom, then come back in, but you had rock wrapped, rock was fabric, yeah, that's a 30 mile over thing that doesn't make any sense, which is a different. So do you want to just try yours? No, I know that, but that's what he made, he made, he made it right, he was making rock covers, yeah, okay, so do we just want to try your method? I would go with the fabric in the ground, the fabric [1:07:17] Mark: fabric in the gravel and the surface grab, okay, that the fabric is just there, keep the TJ knows about this, yeah, keeps the fines from the gravel that is there, yeah, we're mixing with the good gravel that we put on top, okay, in a perfect world with all the money you would go in there, you would cut out all the junk that's there and put it on you, and it's not necessary, but that, so then this is a band-aid too, a permanent band-aid, it works, yeah, long term, so on that road we're going to redo it, but you're in not that section. Oh, you don't think so? Well, you know, I was hoping not to, but yeah, you don't really need to, it's out of that crazy, you know, so the [1:07:58] Brian: consensus then is to is to go in, grade it, put in a large, what minimum, what maximum size rock, four inch, four inch, but I believe it's type B, how deep of a lift, that's up for [1:08:15] Mark: Our decision making process. So you did, you're doing that before you put the fabric over? No, fabric first. Fabric right on top of the road. What's that? I don't think we put what they've [1:08:26] Brian: done is they backed off over a rock thing and just putting rock down and what balance finds [1:08:34] Mark: it finds it on the road as it exists. Okay, so you can school it up a little bit first. Be nice [1:08:38] Brian: and we can, we have some dimensions. So you're going to put the fabric down and degrade it, then you're going to put four inch minus rock down, two clubs of eight inches, eight inches, yeah, okay. And then what's on top of that? Of surface gravel. Look, we just the three, the three-quarter respect brown four, okay, four inches, okay. So you have a total of the foot, right? Okay, so that and then we're looking at that for next sometime next year. Well, [1:09:10] Mark: I thought we said fall of 27. [1:09:12] Brian: Yeah, well that's next year. That's okay, that's next year. All right, okay. So that, but we still, we still want to do that as a unit. We still want to recommend the town do that. [1:09:28] Mark: Yes, okay, good, all right. Section of this we had some national soil. What happened? I'm gonna say [1:09:36] Brian: I'm gonna say it's a thousand feet, thousand fifteen hundred feet. We'll get to, we'll get the specs to you, but okay, because it, we've got, we've got three or four years, three or four months now to figure out the RFP on it, [1:09:53] Mark: which is good. They're gonna do a survey. [1:09:58] Brian: Okay. So, and the new business, an RFP for reclaiming the Berry Road and the Richmond Mills Road. And so you are gonna do the preliminary survey for us so that you can go back and say, One of the comments that I would make is I really like the way that what we've done and what's done because we had to is that we're having one contract to do everything. So they're going to the one contract, you put it out as an RFP and it says put these cross coverts in and reclaim as opposed to putting out two different RFPs. Is that all right with the committee to do it that way? [1:10:43] Speaker F (unidentified): So, yes, I think it is so much better having Pike be the covert contractor and a paving company with other reclaimed companies. [1:10:52] Brian: So it's just smooth. Yeah. But if some other company came in, whatever company it is, but by putting the two together and not having two separate RFPs. [1:11:06] Shannon: Right. That's what Brian's saying. Yeah. [1:11:09] Mark: Okay. Okay, so this time it worked out, I think. [1:11:12] David: Yeah. I don't know if it'll work every time. Exactly. They were hungry this time. [1:11:16] Mark: They were hungry this time, so it was a little bit of concern if they're not hungry, because then you've eliminated a lot of people that don't pay you, right? The bike was hungry and nobody else was. Then my only other concern is that if you do something like that and then they go and sub it out, well, then we're paying a percentage that they're taking a markup on the south, which we haven't done in the past. But if you want to start doing it. But didn't we do it? [1:11:52] David: Even this time, either or. Right now, we've bundled it all together. It was one bundle or something like that. No, it's a separate question, didn't we? Yeah, it was a separate question. I would say we stay that. Then we have the option and they have the option to bundle it together if they want, like Pike did this year. Here. I think it opens the door to more. They did it in Bonneville. [1:12:11] Mark: They did it in Bonneville. They just bit it that way. [1:12:15] Brian: So then what you're talking about is to put out two RFPs. One for the cross culverts and the ditching and that kind of stuff. And the second one for the reclamation. [1:12:30] Speaker E (unidentified): Now would there be additional [1:12:31] Shannon: gravel for Berry Road? Because I know that there's certain areas, I think at the bottom of the hill [1:12:36] Speaker E (unidentified): know where the big yeah we talked about adding gravel there they will when they could they'll [1:12:41] Brian: come back with their with their survey and they'll have that information because they're going to do the survey of the road to find out what's got to be done for across country across culverts and things and they'll come back with that same like just like they did I'd scramble good point but [1:12:56] Mark: there are a couple of spots we should raise up a little bit yeah before the Frenchy when they're [1:13:01] Speaker F (unidentified): grinders they were able to do parts gravel without adding any additional gravity so which is good okay so that just it depends on what it looks like right they didn't put anything in after [1:13:13] David: they pulled those rocks out what they hold them true from so that would be in there [1:13:18] Speaker F (unidentified): it's probably in the three thousand yeah they probably had some ground i'm sure and then there's also a third rfp which is to finish off the ground shoulders which [1:13:31] Brian: well that kind of that glass so it's not i don't know it's so broken up the one that was done two years ago when they did the finish off the shoulders i don't know that an rfp was out but stevenson did that two years ago after we had put the inch course down then stevenson [1:13:52] Speaker E (unidentified): Got the contract to do that was his last problem, and it's saying that they didn't get. That's all I worked on for you. It says dump. [1:14:00] Speaker G (unidentified): Yeah, but- I knew that was dump. [1:14:03] Brian: But in this- But Stevenson did- What was it? I'm trying to think of the three roads. They've been using back up any of those last year. It was before. I'm trying to think. Three years ago. We did two or three roads that we put the inch-to-inch surface on. [1:14:19] David: Without a bit of much feedback. [1:14:21] Mark: I just gotta, that was it. [1:14:23] Brian: Anyway, but we did two or three roads that we that we they put that Stevenson came in and put the gravel in the on the shoulder to bring it up to the inch and I can't tell you what the roads are now I wish I could [1:14:40] Mark: That's the ones that we've done for this you know he's green troops [1:14:43] David: Oh I bet you're right it's one of the ground wasn't it yes it wasn't all winter propound yeah [1:14:49] Brian: They were asked to fill a couple of spots and they did the whole rooms yeah okay so that went out as a separate contract and it was that an RFP do you remember I don't remember ch yes it was a phone call okay so that it was under the RFP requirement so the phone calls okay so do we want to make three contracts to do the actually well yeah three it would be do the preparation for the for the reclamation the reclamation the inch wearing surface and then the fourth contract would be the to fill in The [1:15:30] Speaker E (unidentified): Shoulders we're also considering tree looming and brush removal still too right so four [1:15:38] Speaker F (unidentified): Four yeah if [1:15:42] David: You're gonna do the class we'll do the whole project correct yeah then that would [1:15:46] Brian: Be all together and that would be that would be in there so that would be five contracts [1:15:51] Shannon: Five RSPs treatment brush stitching culverts reclaiming paving and shoulder work four [1:15:58] Brian: Well you got two yeah reclaiming is one and paving them no they're not labeled together both the two inch and the one inch no well if you're reclaiming two inch yeah and then you come back in a year later and put an inch in so that's two separate RFPs that's correct [1:16:18] Mark: The following year though yeah because it's the following year but yeah somebody else yeah [1:16:24] Brian: Yeah big yeah the paper might have a cheaper price for the website for one section of road then there are five RFPs that go out over the course of a year and a half there you go [1:16:37] Mark: Okay yeah and it's complicated but it should be cost more cost effective so okay the choices [1:16:47] Brian: You gotta decide it for them, so anything else about reclamation for Barry and Richard Mills and the number of RFPs and things. Okay, so my next thing on here is, I know we're a little early, but do we, should look at what we want to recommend for budget items to the budget committee, and do we want to leave it like it is now, do we want to raise any of the cost this year for 250? So I wouldn't say that. No, that I'm not talking about the, I'm not talking about the reserve, I'm talking about the budget committee, the budget, the 190,000, 190,000, 190,000 maintenance, of which, of which about 90,000 is available for non-contract stuff. There's a hundred thousand, it's a contracted grading and that, but there's like the ditching and that kind of stuff, there's about ninety thousand dollars. Do we want to change the numbers of the budget? And we don't need to do it now, we just need to think about it. I [1:18:04] Speaker F (unidentified): thought there you were. [1:18:05] David: You had some, let's go to the last year, you were able to work with everything, right? Yeah, we [1:18:10] Brian: went, yeah, I've got a little bit of a total amount. We didn't do, we didn't do any maintenance last [1:18:16] Shannon: year, but again, this will, I mean, whatever you put in for this year will be acquired until next [1:18:21] Brian: October, correct? Yeah, really, but we didn't, but we didn't do any maintenance, we haven't done any maintenance, right? That's not, that's not true, we have, we've done a little bit, we've done painting, we've done, yeah, but that, but that's a contract, that's, I'm not considering that part of that [1:18:38] Shannon: portion of it, all those other things on the operational account, most of it's contractual, so that's going to get paid out, it doesn't know if it hasn't already under the remaining amount for 220,000. I mean, even the winter sand and what it's called is contractual, so that's another 90,000 out of that, so that brings you down to 130,000. Yeah, and all the other 30,000, I mean calcium chloride is going to get done, sweeping is going to get done, painting is going to get done, culverts is only 5,000, so we will probably buy more culverts for sure. Gravel, grading and ditching are bigger ones, and we'll start incorporating some of that. [1:19:20] Brian: We had about $90,000 of non-contractual maintenance in the current budget. Do we want to leave those numbers like they are? We don't need to make the decision now, but we just need to look at it and think about it. Okay, I think it'll be good to prioritize. [1:19:44] Shannon: What the big projects are that you want to do, like Hardscrabble and Fairbanks Overlay, the Berry and Richmond Mills, all of those things. You've got this Dexter Pond, Rock Sandwich. We've got to also do this Lovejoy Pond, Walton. [1:20:05] Speaker F (unidentified): Yeah, we have to gravel the eight roads we're finishing right now. Yeah, and then have we done anything with the Mount Pisgah drain, the big culvert? Right, and be very rich. Yeah. [1:20:19] Mark: Yeah, that should be, that goes out to all of our things to be figuring out, because it's going to. [1:20:26] Speaker E (unidentified): Be major, in fact. Yeah, so timekeeper, and then. [1:20:33] Shannon: Gary Rove Albert. Yeah, so I mean, there's some big things on here. What's the priority of them that we want to start looking at? Lovejoy Pond-Balton Culvert, Hart's Brattle and Fairbanks Overlay, Berry and Richmond Mills Roads Reclaim, Dexter Pond-Rock Sandwich, Tempe Bridge, Berry Road Culvert. [1:20:59] David: Berry Road Culvert is going to be done first, then we'll do the other side. [1:21:02] Mark: Right before you do Berry Road and Brackett, once you're going to do those. Okay. Like the grading contractors should already be out. So if we're going to make a priority thing, get the gradients and that is it. [1:21:27] Shannon: Well, that's operational. I'm talking about like your capital reserves projects, like those big projects that you're going to be asking for in the equity budget, because this won't really change significantly. I'm sure it will, given the cost of everything right now. So we'll take a look at that and do a little bit of an analysis on it, but more of the bigger projects that we're going to want to have to start planning out for. Before, and then again, like what's, what can we do now, and then what do we want to do near after? Like maybe the overlay and the culvert might be more feasible, and then we can start doing the grading, or excuse me, start doing the ditching and the tree work on Barry and Richmond in preparation for the following year when we do like the culvert, and then the other stuff we can make that group project or something, and then yeah, Tempe Bridge, Dexter Rock Pond, and then you had. [1:22:22] Speaker E (unidentified): Also talked about Dexter Pond reconstruction down there, right, so, and widening the road, I'd say for. [1:22:29] David: For like big longer projects, you get your temporary bridge because you got to go through the engineer instead of trying to get some money. Those things should be a like an ongoing large project, Dexter Pond Road large project specialty. The other is more paving and maintenance, right? And we're, we're, I mean, we're doing pretty well on the roads. I mean, we're knocking them off. There's never ending, don't get me wrong, but we're, we're getting a further ahead pretty quickly right now. I mean, not because we're getting a lot. Not this is coming up. Those are your two big ones, and they have little ones. You got whatever you've got. [1:23:11] Brian: We have a priority of those roads already. Yeah, we've done that. We've done that. 's in the list. I disagree with Henry, and then I don't, I say we don't spend all the money to do one little project that's low on priority. We save that money and we do a little bit a bigger project. It gets high on priority. Personally, Henry wants to spend all the money this week, this year, and do the little projects that don't may not be a priority, or he wanted to, he's not with us now. [1:23:46] Mark: But that's okay. So the other thing I have to say about that is that if the budget's going to get cut because things don't get done, then we don't want to end up getting the budgets cut because the things need to be done. [1:24:03] Brian: Just because they didn't get done, [1:24:05] Mark: doesn't mean that they don't need to be done. So in that aspect, I think at some level, we need to figure out a way to get the things done so the budget doesn't get cut. Yeah. [1:24:17] David: I think, Martin, it's more of how you explained it. We know these things are coming up, so we are going to go and ask for X amount of money. Well, we have some justification there. We have, we're asking for this money because of XYZ, and we're putting money aside. Some of this capital is because we know that you've got temporary bridge, you've got some major things that you have to have a little bit of cushion. But if you're the people counter and you're looking at [1:24:44] Mark: the budget, you say, well, they don't need it because it didn't use. Well, they don't have nothing else. [1:24:50] David: I disagree, I'm sorry, because they don't, because if you're looking at a long-term expenditure. Okay, if you're maintenance, it'll be maintenance. You didn't do maintenance. You left 90,000. Yeah, he's going to be all over us. But if you're asking for 400,000 for capital, we've got reasons for putting that money back over here for capital, because these things are coming up. And the only other option is, oh, will you just go bond it? Well, do you want to, do you want to run your business through a bank all the time or do you want to have the money and get it done? [1:25:24] Mark: Most people run through a bank. [1:25:25] David: Right. Well, so pay yourself and pay the bank. [1:25:29] Mark: So one of the, one of the, I've asked the question is if the bond and I don't know any of the numbers, but if inflation is running 10 percent and the bond is 3 percent, it's cheaper to bond than it is to pay inflation. [1:25:43] David: If that's the case. But I want to look at numbers. [1:25:47] Brian: Our first, well, all right, so yeah, what are the numbers? So one of our, one of our look ats in the next couple three months is to figure out, we've pretty well got listed the jobs that we want to have done, we want to recommend her to gun, so now that's the figure is to do the priorities on those jobs that we want to have done and any other new ones. All right, we need to look at the budget numbers. One of the things we haven't talked about is how much reserve do we want to request from the budget committee this year or is that, does that go to the budget committee or does that go to the council? It goes to the budget committee and board. Okay, budget committee, and then the budget committee gives it to the board, and you know, so if you read our task or whatever that is, that paperwork, yeah, we had, okay, charge it says that we do budgeting, yeah, but we are exactly like the [1:26:49] Mark: budget committee, we have no authority, so our budget got cut this year, yeah, without a recommendation [1:26:57] Brian: and I don't know, so but that, but we still, we're, we recommended the budget committee that this is what we would like to have, but we don't, or do we recommend to the town, yeah, or do we put an x [1:27:13] Shannon: dollar amount on that? If you, I mean, that's what I'm saying, if you have the list of priorities and you pick out I want to do these three things, you come up with an estimate for it and then say [1:27:22] Brian: this is what I want. So do we give it directly to the budget committee or do we, do we give it [1:27:29] Mark: To give you the ability to go to the budget committee. [1:27:33] Brian: Okay. Cause that's when I read that charge, I wasn't really scared about that. Okay. The bill of liaison. [1:27:41] Shannon: The bill of liaison, yeah. [1:27:42] Mark: I'm not suggesting it goes back to- Just it'll get there. [1:27:47] Brian: So we need to talk about budgets. And then the last thing I got on there is that I would recommend that we leave the clause in the in the warrant that says anything not used rolls over to our to our reserve I agree two years ago that didn't happen to the snowmobile fund something somebody dropped it and it didn't get rolled over at the town meeting so I just want to make sure that we don't do that with us so okay [1:28:28] David: you're a new business i'm not a new business okay so we got new business okay i think we should cut the trees below the north lane dam extensively because we're just asking for an atheist they think going and going and going if we ever have a big water flood it could block that bridge and [1:28:47] Mark: would you lose the bridge as well so that's what we need to do but there's a hope we need to do [1:28:54] David: the trees at the town well no message the town dam doesn't because there's no bridge downstream from the town dam and wait here you've got a bridge right below these trees right below the dance break you've got that's where your problem lies not just the trees down under there and i think the door is open after i saw what the state did at the boat launch they got a lot of trees within our view of the water and they stripped it so good they can do it we can do it 's a safety issue yeah okay that was an extreme safety issue and it probably needs to be done [1:29:28] Mark: later the root structures are bothering the village then they should be taken care of [1:29:33] David: too if that's the cage yeah you're talking the ones right around the dam not down below it [1:29:38] Speaker F (unidentified): below building they're below that flows too they're right they're right there with the [1:29:44] David: waterfalls oh right yeah all that has to come on i understand that i thought right here that [1:29:49] Brian: that voice here they're more below okay so then what is your recommendation that we cut the trees below this both dams and cut the trees around the dams yeah then who's going to do the survey to [1:30:02] Speaker G (unidentified): to say what trees get cut the dam keeper i just asked him i just asked yeah any tree any tree growing out of a dam is a bad thing they all need to come down if they're growing out of the of the of it of the dam because if a tree comes over and the root ball comes up you'll destroy [1:30:22] David: The integrity of the dam, okay, I brought it up to begin with. It, they were below the dam, which they are here, but the others are actually in the dam down there. Yeah, but either way, they both are. [1:30:33] Mark: Yeah, here it's a double because you could clog the bridge and then have a big problem. [1:30:38] Brian: Down there, yes. So then who was who in the committee, or do we hire somebody to come in and say these trees get cut? We can do it without working with Ryan. We can just like, I don't. [1:30:51] Speaker E (unidentified): Get a picture and then a picture and just throw a mark. Yeah, oh yeah,, so. [1:30:59] Brian: So between Dave and Brian, then you will come up with a recommendation for the trees to get cut. [1:31:09] David: We'll cut the stuff, but on Palm Bro, Lucas Street was in cutting, they cut a bunch of. [1:31:15] Shannon: That was a personal, I think somebody had hired them, or yeah, it's true, you know, that's that's. [1:31:21] David: Gonna be my side, yeah, that was a personal one, so yeah, looks better. Any other new. [1:31:26] Brian: Business to come before the board before the committee? You have anything, man? No. [1:31:32] Mark: I had a regurgitated business, but just still left playing on a winter road and the stuff, I don't know, Biscuit Road on the corner, Wash, I don't know which one is still there. Yeah, that's over by the radio farms. Yeah, okay, thank you. And what was the other one? It was right around the corner of Mount Pisgah, right by Fed Bank, said there's a pothole that is very familiar to a lot of people with trailers. [1:32:07] Speaker E (unidentified): It's on the inside of the corner, inside right after, you know, it's an analysis. Yeah, on the right. Yeah,. [1:32:24] Shannon: That looks great, by the way, whoever is working on that. I thought it looked lovely. [Mark: Vincent Timberworks. Ah.] What do you spell that? I started following the Facebook niche. Oh, yes. Facebook niche? Yeah, from like a few years ago. [1:32:39] Mark: I still have Facebook. [1:32:41] Brian: Everybody gets calendars out. I would like to meet once a month because we've got all this stuff. And if we get it ready before December, January, then it's all ready to go next spring. Is there any problem with meeting once a month to do that? Yeah. So what's a good month? What's a good time for October? [1:33:23] Speaker E (unidentified): The first. Yeah,. [1:33:27] David: I'm only available the well, the 30 conversation. [1:33:30] Mark: Is there any chance we can move the time out earlier? Is everybody there? Oh, earlier in the morning on our meetings. That's fine. Does anybody. [1:33:43] Brian: Mind if we go up early? No, it's because Shannon's coming in on her own time, more or less is why we set 930. But, you know, eight o'clock is fine earlier. What time? Pick a time. Eight,. [1:33:56] Speaker E (unidentified): Eight, thirty. That's fine. Eight's fine with me. Eight or seven better? No. No,. [1:34:02] Mark: Survey. So I'll get some work done. Okay. [1:34:08] Brian: So what date, what dates are available towards the end of October? [1:34:15] Speaker F (unidentified): We're going to keep on Monday. [1:34:17] David: So it'd be 19 or 26. [1:34:19] Mark: Do you select Sunday, Shannon? Yeah. That's fine. [1:34:22] Shannon: Earlier on Monday is even better. [1:34:24] David: Eight o'clock on the 26th. [1:34:25] Brian: TJ, October 26 at 8 o'clock. Okay with you? Yes, good, okay. So that's what was set up. Can you see us, TJ, or just here? I can see you. [1:34:41] Speaker G (unidentified): Yeah, I see you right now, looking right at you, green shirt. Is it green? Looks green, looks. [1:34:49] Speaker F (unidentified): I didn't mean those faces I was making at you. Yes, he did. Yes, he did. So it's 26 to the. [1:35:01] Mark: Yeah. Are you in a movie theater? What's that big curtain behind you? [1:35:04] Speaker G (unidentified): I'm in a hotel room. Where? I'm in San Francisco. [1:35:11] Mark: Wow. Working or budget? [1:35:15] Speaker G (unidentified): Well, I left early to get out of town for the Nor'easter, so a few days of, you know, fun. And then today I got a two-day conference I'm going to, and then I'll be back Wednesday. [Speaker F (unidentified): Day, so I.] got a couple i got a couple days of sightseeing pretty cool how was the northeaster down there because it really didn't do anything up here until well we got a ton of rain and wind and they just canceled a bunch of flights so i decided to leave friday that's all yeah you know but up where we live nothing serious down on the shore there's some flooding and stuff like that yeah we didn't even get wet last night no rain oh man it's still raining in connecticut right now it's we've been getting Just hammered with rain. Yeah, my dad lives on the Cape. I should probably come home. Good idea. Southern Maine got some, got some damage, got some, sir, didn't they? I think they're talking about down in like the Wells area. [1:36:27] Brian: Portland, the Portland got two inches of rain yesterday, so we were supposed to take the. [1:36:33] Speaker F (unidentified): Ferry back from Yarmouth, Nova Scotia, on Friday, but I was like in a castle and just drove around. [1:36:48] Brian: So thank you all. I'll go get my new truck and go have a good day. [1:36:54] Speaker F (unidentified): You got smashed up. Thank you, TJ.